This Credit Union Is Disgusting – Share This Video

Fred Weaver and Kevin Kauffman discuss a recent short sale with an active military member via Navy Federal Credit Union.


Get instant access to our online masterclass to learn the simple steps.


Kevin and Fred the founders of Group 46:10. Over the last 10 years Kevin and Fred, and their team have closed tens of millions in real estate all over the country and have created some of the best training for agents in the market. Kevin and Fred are also highly sought after teachers whose work has helped agents all over the country build their own next level real estate business.


Get instant access to our online masterclass to learn the simple steps.

About the Authors


Kevin Kauffman & Fred Weaver

Kevin and Fred the founders of Group 46:10. Over the last 10 years Kevin and Fred, and their team have closed tens of millions in real estate all over the country and have created some of the best training for agents in the market. Kevin and Fred are also highly sought after teachers whose work has helped agents all over the country build their own next level real estate business.

Popular Posts This Week

Reader Comments


  1. Mary on March 23, 2011 at 6:41 am

    Why is the credit union responsible for the real estate market? They let someone borrow money in good faith to purchase a home and I don’t understand why you think it’s the credit unions obligation to forgive the loan. If she had purchased with cash, who would take the responsibility for the poor investment – the purchaser. It’s unfortunate that we have turned to blaming the people that gave us the money for our poor investment choices. I understand that she is in the military and I really appreciate her service but I question the decision to even purchase a home if you know that you can be transferred at any time.

    • skip odea on March 23, 2011 at 7:15 am

      WOW, so if you are in the military you can’t purchase a home and enjoy the same benifets of home ownership as everyone else. Lets see, give the military crystal balls so they can read the future so we can avoid housing bubbles, wars in the middle east. I’am sure our present goverment is working on this as we speak. See you guys in Balto April 7, maybe Vegas if I can get my crystal ball to work

    • Kevin Kauffman on March 23, 2011 at 7:40 am

      Mary – She is being forced to move because of her role in the military that protects you. Despite the fact that there a numerous other reasons “why” most of which are actually beneficial to the Credit Union Arizona is a non deficiency judgment state – The credit union has no legal recourse in the state of Arizona in this case.

  2. Derek on March 23, 2011 at 7:09 am

    Hmmm…. I wonder were Mary works. First off, she didn’t purchase for cash so don’t try and use that as an argument. It doesn’t apply. 2nd, nobody is blaming the people who gave the borrower the money. It is a request for help. This is a situation that has no other solution than to short sale. You mention their choice of a “poor investment”. Since when is purchasing a home for you and your family at current market value in a rising market considered a “poor investment”. If it was such a poor investment then shouldn’t you have reconsidered your position to lend money… Also, do we hear time and time again from the president, news, media, etc that now is the time to buy. Buying a home is an American right. It is a process of building long term investments and security. The phoenix market dropped over 53%!!! Tell me any other investment that could drop by that and survive. This whiped out an entire cities values! Lastly, you have 0 respect for military personal. Shame on you! I served in the military and so have many people I know. It is a honored duty that provides you the comfort to sit your lazy ass in the chair you typed this pathetic email from. So, from the position you take you are saying that nobody in the military should buy a home because they have the possibility of being relocated… What??? You are an idiot. Being in service to your country shouldn’t mean you can’t have the American dream you work so hard to protect. You are discriminating against our military with that statement. This person absolutely deserved that right. She could not control factors that had nothing to do with her. She also was not part of the problem(investors, builders, lenders). She bought the home to live in. Nobody ever expects to be deployed or relocated and shouldn’t put their life on hold for the unknown. Mary, take your small minded mentality and show some respect! Plus a bunch of other cuss words that I will save for the idiotic response I expect you will post because you are obviously too dumb to realize when you are wrong.

  3. leo on March 23, 2011 at 8:24 am

    Looks like Derek simply had diarrhea of the mounth. First of, although I completely disagree with Mary’s idiotic position, no one has the “right” to own a home! There’s no such right and should not be.

    Although the Nevy Federal position is absolute crap and they know they are taking a chance, they obviously know their nitch customer well, as far as undertanding that most of their customers, unfortunately, will have aversion to foreclosure or negative credit impact. Thus, they’re operating from a possition of leverage. Thus, unless your client has the gall to let them foreclose and it gets closer to that point, I think they will hold steady.

  4. Mo Perez on March 23, 2011 at 8:27 am

    This is horrible, is it even legal for them to freeze other accounts? I mean Ive heard of credit limits being reduced on Credit Cards and HELOCS being frozen, but if actual savings and checking accounts? Thats wrong. Id have an attorney look into that, seems like some pretty shady strong-arming. Ive dealt with other credit unions and they do come across pretty hardcore initially, have you tried waiving the prom note in exchange for a cash contribution? Ive gotten $130K+ prom notes waived in exchange for $1K or $2K cash contribution from all parties involved just to get the deal done. BTW as of Jan 1st of this year, if a bank accepts a short sale, they MUST waive all deficiencies, so why is the prom note even coming up?? Best of Luck.

  5. wayne on March 23, 2011 at 8:31 am

    This is unfortunate for the member, but the Credit Union has to look out for the interests of the full member pool. The short fall is going to be absorbed by the full membership. Take ten deals of this size and you have a million dollars in losses. That affects the ability to make loans to others.

    This is tough for the member and the credit union.

  6. Kevin Kauffman on March 23, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Am I the only one that realizes foreclosing on this home will actually cost the credit union MORE money? Therefore the credit union is actually harming its bottom line and other “members”

  7. leo on March 23, 2011 at 9:09 am

    there’s no question that it will cost them more if it goes to foreclosure and they are scum for not helping out, but if you read my previous remarks, you’ll see that I believe they don’t believe that your client will let foreclosure happen. At least they are willing to make that wager.
    As I stated, they know their nitch client!

  8. John on March 23, 2011 at 9:39 am

    So you want our opinion? This is one of the biggest pieces of self indulgent, unprofessional garbage that I have ever listened to. Let’s review your facts one more time.
    • Your client purchased a house while being employed in a transient business – no problem there being former military I fully understand that and can appreciate that she may have had limited choices for available housing at the time – although she is probably receiving an additional housing allowance due to lack of military housing options. But why not ask the Department of the Navy to pick up the tab; after all they are requiring her to move not Navy Fed. Sounds like our government should be looking out for our service members a little more and that you are taking your rant to the wrong place. How about you? How much have you reduced your commission in order to help out your client? Let’s get the deal done, after all isn’t that what this is about?
    • Financial institution wants a promissory note for the deficiency, again no issue there. Have you gone back to Navy Fed to try and get this waived or reduced the amount or did you go right to and I will use your phrase Terrorist reporting tactics?
    • Closure or freezing of accounts, your client was aware of this prior to joining Navy Fed. Credit Unions are basically co-ops and in their By-laws (which all members receive) it will most likely have a cross collateralization clause and an acknowledgement from your client agreeing that all accounts and/or shares will be provided as security for all other obligations that they may have with that institution. Again, why would that pose an issue now as your client has known about it for at least nine years?
    Credit Unions are a co-op where people employed or belonging to like groups can pool their money and provide each other with lower cost loans that they might not be able to obtain at another financial institution. They are not owned by investors nor do they receive Federal funds or bailout money. All losses incurred have to be absorbed by the entire membership. With that being said I fail to see what the problem is with Navy Fed trying to look out for the 3.6 million members that they serve.

    • kevin on March 23, 2011 at 11:17 am

      Thanks for the comment John.

  9. Rowena on March 23, 2011 at 10:26 am

    Wow. I’m really disappointed in the comments being made here. This service member is just trying to do the right thing to get out of a bad situation. She didn’t just walk and let another home become a blight on the face of AZ, she reached out to try and negotiate an amicable deal to mitigate loss for both parties (and the members). I really can’t believe you all don’t see that the housing market has made these type of negotiations commonplace in the Southwest, and that other banks get it and are cooperating. Apparently you are all bitter about your own circumstances and are projecting your aggravation.

  10. Kevin Hardin on March 23, 2011 at 11:02 am

    Kevin and Fred,

    Though I agree that the document you quote in your email remains on its face is a dire indictment of the Credit Union industry on how it responds to short sale demands from its members. Our firm has seen many of them and it is rare for common sense to prevail. That said, is this really the level of professionalism you are looking to portray? You have a client that desires a result that is frankly needed.

    1) No financial institution allows anyone to open an account without signing specific disclosures one of those gives the financial institution the right of Set Off. So rule one for every short sale client has to be, if they cannot or will not make the mortgage payment to move any money at the bank they intend to default on. It is legal for them, the CU, to sweep the account and to further, due to their membership agreement, cancel benefits afforded members. One item they cannot remove is the right of the member to save money in that institution or it would be a breach of their charter

    2) Navy Fed is, in addition to being the largest CU, also a rated Servicer and sells most of their loans Servicing Retained. In addition, they are also a Ginnie Mae issuer meaning even the VA and FHA loans they might do are retained servicing but, rarely do they hold in port 1st mortgages. I think your post is significantly lacking without an analysis of whether this was a 1st mortgage or 2nd. Was there only one loan and whether it was conventional or VA?

    3) Why do you guys keep beating up servicers on the morality front or public sentiment? Here in AZ, the Deed of Trust that was signed by CU and borrower, has NO language requiring the CU to do anything for that homeowner at all other than to foreclose if the homeowner does not make payments. If the lender, in this case the CU, responds in an obtuse way, then instead of whining, stick the home up the lender’s left nostril. I don’t say that to be nice language. It is a smaller hole and much more painful. If the mortgage is in fact governed by ARS 33-814(g) or ARS 33-729 then the homeowner will owe nothing past the Trustee Sale.

    4) The next real relevant question is does the service member has a security clearance above Secret that might be in jeopardy if a foreclosure were to occur? If so, the CU will know that or suspect it. That gives them leverage. The service member has protections that they can discuss with JAG and should have prior to even engaging the CU in the discussion.

    You guys are some of the smartest Short Sale guys in the game but I believe you significantly diminish your value to this market and your clients by the sophmoric display that you present.

    Oh, P.S. I clicked on the video above and it opened up in Youtube. It says that the post goes by the handle of yumacriminal96 Really? That is your login for youtube?

    • kevin on March 23, 2011 at 11:17 am

      Kevin H – Thanks for your comments… While I couldn’t disagree with you more on some of them I agree do agree with you “If the mortgage is in fact governed by ARS 33-814(g) or ARS 33-729 then the homeowner will owe nothing past the Trustee Sale. ”

      At least we have some common ground.

  11. RobR on March 23, 2011 at 2:33 pm

    The CU ALSO invested – they sent an appraiser and said “yup, this looks like a good investment”. So why do people like Mary ONLY blame the borrower when the lender had the right to refuse the loan initially?

    If Kevin H above is correct then this loan has been sold to an investor, then the CU is simply doing what most servicers do – saying “no” and delaying because they make more money the longer this goes on. And therefore there is ZERO downside to the other CU members – only upside by collecting servicer fees from the investor. So don’t cry for the other CU members – unless of course they get into financial trouble in which case the NFCU may try to f- them too.

    Hopefully we’ll get an update on this in the near future – and we’ll see if Kevin H’s accusation that this video isn’t helping, actually does help their client by shaming the CU publically.

  12. Keith on March 23, 2011 at 3:44 pm

    WOW!!!!! Where to start……

    Mary…..This service member who protects your right to a stupid opinion needs help as does Navy Fed. If NFCU were to get the property back they loose about 20% more than if they foreclosed. How is forcing foreclosure good business if it creates higher losses???

    Leo….. look it up…..we do have THE RIGHT to own property…
    Property is any physical or intangible entity that is owned by a person or jointly by a group of people. Depending on the nature of the property, an owner of property has the right to consume, sell, rent, mortgage, transfer, exchange or destroy their property, and/or to exclude others from doing these things.[1][2][3] Important widely recognized types of property include real property (land), personal property (physical possessions belonging to a person), private property (property owned by legal persons or business entities), public property (state owned or publicly owned and available possessions) and intellectual property (exclusive rights over artistic creations, inventions, etc.), although the latter is not always as widely recognized or enforced.[4] A title, or a right of ownership, establishes the relation between the property and other persons, assuring the owner the right to dispose of the property as they see fit. Some philosophers assert that property rights arise from social convention. Others find origins for them in morality or natural law.

  13. Keith on March 23, 2011 at 3:48 pm

    Kevin Harden …you seem big into people doing their homework…… maybe Kevin K went to Yuma High School where they’re mascot is a criminal….. judgmental blow hard!!!!

    Wayne……how does the CU forcing the borrower into foreclosure (which costs the CU 20% more than short sale) protect the full membership????? Pull your head out before you make a stupid comment like that….

    • Andrew on March 23, 2011 at 10:53 pm

      Really? It’s the “Yuma Criminals”??? I thought you were making that up, so I looked it up… On the website in bold letters: “Proud Home of the Criminals!”

      The logo is really funny.


  14. Kerri Naslund on March 23, 2011 at 4:27 pm

    Ummmmmm nice shirt Kevin….. To all those who don’t get it….take your cranky pants off and suck it! (running away from comment board as fast as possible)

  15. carefreejackie on March 24, 2011 at 1:02 am

    @ Kerri ~ What you said. Runnnnnn.
    @ Kevin and Fred ~ You sure opened up pandora’s box on this one. Wholly schmolly! Who knew you’d get so many comments from negative nellies? This was one of your better shows. STAND PROUD MEN. And . . . GO CRIMINALS. What a hoot! Once your video goes viral, everyone will know some little school in Yuma has a politically incorrect mascot. Wonder if the judicial system will be offended? Ha ha ha.

  16. leo on March 24, 2011 at 7:23 am

    When I said that there’s no right to own, I meant that it’s ultimately a choice someone makes. And further, the person still needs to qualify for credit. So in that sense, it’s a personal choice and a privelage.

  17. Mary on March 24, 2011 at 5:33 pm

    My goodness, so many responders that didn’t understand my comment. My point was, it’s not the financial institutions fault. It’s the investor/purchasers responsibility. Yet, everyone blames the good guy, the one that gave her the money. If you invest in the stock market and the stock goes down, you don’t go back to your bank and blame them because they allowed you to withdraw the money. If you buy lemonade at a kids stand and spill it, you don’t blame the kid that sold it to you. Take responsibility for your own actions. This has nothing to do with her being in the military or if its a bank or a credit union. It is simply a bad investment, no ones fault but only one persons responsibility. My house is under water – if I get transferred I will rent it out or live minimally in the new location while still paying my old mortgage. It’s a responsibility that I signed for and I take seriously. Again, I value her service and sincerely appreciate it, it’s not about that.

    • danofearth on April 13, 2011 at 8:05 pm

      I think Mary, you’re missing the point. The Credit Union certainly does not have to forgive anybodies’ debt…period. They did indeed loan the money out “In good faith”. Part of the video is commenting on the CU’s bad economic/business decision of creating unreasonable mitigation ploys, thereby creating greater losses for the CU, and the other is a remark on their marketing tactics.
      If you loose your house and the bank takes a loss of $20K…..where in the subjects of Ethics, Morality, Human Interest, or even debt collection principles is it fair or even NEAR “right” to demand an additional $125K note plus interest to be paid to the CU….OR ELSE. I promise you the mafia isn’t even THAT predatary. And that’s the operative word….predatary practice. I will bet that that note is SO voracious and greedy, it could possibly be deemed null and void in some courts if the seller just claimed they signed it under duress.
      Lastly, to name yourself the “Navy Credit Union” and center your marketing around it implies favorable terms to Navy personel. I want you to look up the definition of a “Credit Union”. A credit union is a cooperative financial institution that is owned and controlled by its members for the purpose of promoting thrift, providing credit at reasonable rates, and to further community development. Hardly a mandate that encourages loss mitigation surpassing even the most aggressive, adversarial banking standards. And….to top it off, using the said predatory practices on our ACTIVE MILITARY PERSONNEL is atrocious.
      I say hit them where it hurts! I’m emailing the president of the Credit Union National Association (Bill Cheney) a link to this video. I will also email it to the World Council of Credit Unions and the National Credit Union Foundation. If you, Mary, and anybody elsae who think there’s nothing wrong with it, then those emails shoudn’t be cause for alarm. I’m guessing that there might be a problem. Hmmm.

Leave a Comment